I've been a bit poorly recently (have I mentioned that before?), and last week's chat with The Restaurant's Sarah Willingham went a bit by the wayside (apologies for that). Even though I'm on my way back to bed with a newspaper, I managed to chat to Sarah on Friday before this damn head cold kicked me in the nadgers. Anyway, this week's episodes were, once again, terrific, and it was time to say goodbye to Helen and Stephen. Who saw that coming after their excellent start to the series? It seemed the wheels were slowly coming off the couple's bid to bring a family restaurant to the masses as the weeks went by. Go over the jump and you'll see what Sarah made of it all...

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TV Scoop: Hi Sarah. Another two fantastic shows this week...
Sarah Willingham: Weren't they great? I told you it was going to get difficult!

TVS: You're so right. Let's start with Helen and Stephen. Their concept seemed to be something that Raymond would buy into.
SW: Absolutely. We absolutely loved the philosophy and the concept. Based on that philosophy, you could base a very strong and successful restaurant.

TVS: But...
SW: Steve is a legend. He really is very, very good actually. The problem was that Helen's food was just not the type of food you would pay a lot of money for in a restaurant. It wasn't cheap either. They were busy where they were, but I think a lot of that was linked to Steve, and also the location - there wasn't much competition where they were. They had a wonderful support from the community, and once again I think that that was linked to the level of service people got when they got they. You were made to feel so special. The quality of food wasn't the same. Having said that what Helen is is that she's organised and methodical in a kitchen and I'm sure that, if she would be trained and would listen, I actually think that they could have a very successful.

TVS: Her food did improve though...
SW: Yes, it did improve quite a lot, but the problem was that there are far better chefs left in the competition.

TVS: Yeah, Russell and James, in particular, are much better...
SW: And Tim. Tim is a very good chef. Despite the duck egg. Bit of a faux pas there.

TVS: I felt genuinely sad to see Helen and Stephen go this week. They started the series so well, and won Restaurant Of The Week. As weeks went by they seemed to go a bit backwards...
SW: Well, the thing is they had a really busy restaurant. That was a fact. Steve was brilliant. He used to walk the streets and he wouldn't be able to pass someone and not get a booking from them. He was brilliant at it, really exceptional. So they had an extremely busy, financially quite successful restaurant. You can't argue with that.

TVS: You guys always made the point though, that the food always seemed to come last...
SW: Yeah. What people forget at this stage, especially this last four, that we're not closing down restaurants because they won't work. That was echoed by Helen's comment at the end when she said that she had to question somebody's judgement to close down a successful restaurant.

TVS: She was quite bullish wasn't she?
SW: Oh yes. But I think that everyone forgets that all four of these couples were very good - they all have strengths and they all have weaknesses but fundamentally they're doing alright. I think with guidance all of them could be successful. We're closing down restaurants now because they're not the best or they're not the right partner for Raymond. And that's the point. It's not about saying that you're rubbish, but saying that the relationship just wouldn't work. We're getting down to much more subjective decisions, because at the end of the day he's looking for a business partner.

TVS: Once again the challenge this week was terrific. Although it seemed like quite an easy one, you think about it and putting together a cook book and writing simple instruction must actually be quite difficult. Helen was so kind of one-track mind and wouldn't budge on her vision of what her book should look like, even though she had a really skilled photographer there to ask advice from.
SW: I don't know what it is with Helen. Somebody told me a few years ago the best thing ever about business and starting your own business - let everybody else take the credit and you will take over the world. Surround yourself with very clever people. Don't have an ego with it. It was a shame, because Helen and Stephen were surrounded by some of the best people in that industry. Their photographer was arguably the best in the industry. To not listen to him or not even ask his advice, from our point of view was really concerning. We asked if they were, ultimately, going to listen to Raymond.

TVS: What I also noticed this week, and we've touched on the whole nature of partnerships, is that one side of the couple seems to be doing very well (Russell's food, James' food etc), but the front of house isn't matching it and people like Alisdair and, especially this week, Michelle, are reacting very emotionally...
SW: Yeah, you're right. You can see they're really under pressure.

TVS: Alisdair had a bit of a rough week. He went into hospital, but thankfully he was ok. But his spelling mistakes, as a journalist, I was just sitting here recoiling in horror. Mayognaise?! There does seem to be an imbalance in the teams. How do you get that over to them without sounding personal?
SW: We are very honest with them. At the same time it's not always how you see it. For example, Alisdair could be better if James communicated better with him. The same with Russell and Michelle. It could be the same situation - if Russell gave Michelle more time looking at front of house, she might feel like less pressure. It's often very easy to criticise what looks like the weaker of the two, but actually it is about the team and communication. Look at the development of Lindsay.

TVS: I was just coming to that. They are the most even team at the moment...
SW: They weren't to begin with though. Now she's fantastic and we've seen her grow. I think hats off to Tim, because quite clearly he has coached her through this. The result is a very balanced team.

TVS: I think they're now real contenders... famous last words. But can I talk briefly about Michelle? She reacted very emotionally to some criticism this week. As judges do you think that shows weakness or passion? Or a bit of both?
SW: A bit of both. Depends on the circumstances. She is very, very passionate about what it is she wants to do. There were times when we questioned that passion, but when it's the most important thing to her it's obvious why she would react so emotionally.

TVS: You guys have, though, accused her of living in a bit of a pink, fluffy, happy bubble. Is this a process of trying to draw her out of that world?
SW: The cook book re-emphasised it. The front page was full of lovely photos of them when they were children. The problem was that they were trying to sell a cook book. The picture of the mackerel was gorgeous... why didn't they put that on the cover? We are constantly trying to drive home that this is not an easy business to be in, especially at the moment. This is a really tough climate to be opening restaurants in. You've got to focus on the bottom line. Of course, if the welcome and warmness isn't there you won't have a bottom line or any profit. At the same time, you've got to make wise and sensible decisions.

TVS: It was quieter for this week wasn't it... Raymond himself visited the restaurants. That threw everyone a little bit...
SW: That's always a lot of pressure. He's not just another customer. He's looking for a partner, so it must have been extremely difficult for them?

TVS: And were you feeling the pressure trying to choose this week? It seems to me that the judging process is getting much tougher.
SW: This week was a nightmare! We spent hours, and I'm not exaggerating, discussing it and we ran so late. There were some obvious couples that were never going to make it, but now it's a real struggle. I think we drove the production team mad!